tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9926230.post7419231026382400745..comments2024-03-26T01:57:54.726-04:00Comments on On The Contrary: Myths and Facts about Kids Going ‘Off the Derech’ in CollegeADDeRabbihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11749876612695930184noreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9926230.post-89668955014100539622006-12-26T09:34:00.000-05:002006-12-26T09:34:00.000-05:00I think it's ridiculous the amount of stock we put...I think it's ridiculous the amount of stock we put in our kids, not to mention our adults, adhering to an outwardly religious mode of life, even if there is nothing but a hollow shell on the inside. Most folks would rather their kids/neighbors be outwardly religious even if they have little to no serious identification with Judaism.<br /><br />On the other hand, we shouldn't overlook and devalue the simple Jew; there is a lot of merit for simply doing Judaism right without a necessarily deep understanding, but a fervernt commitment to the basic ideals.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9926230.post-55159577117184356442006-12-26T09:01:00.000-05:002006-12-26T09:01:00.000-05:00This fits well with a half-baked idea I started fo...This fits well with a half-baked idea I started forming yesterday. I was listening to R' Dr A Twersky speak about the rise of psychological problems, addiction, abuse, divorce, etc... in our community, and he said something that jarred. Even kids who grow up in homes with no TV or internet still go to the supermarket and see what's for sale at the checkout line.<br /><br />But has anyone shown that any of these barriers actually succeeded in lowering the rates for any of these problems? Do chareidim have a smaller dropout rate than MO? Less divorce? Less abuse? Fewer addicts? My impression is that none of us are fairing better than the others Among my classmates in a Chassidish-run / Yeshivish-attended day school, I think the retention was lower than my classmates in R' Riskin's High School, if anything. But close enough to be roughly the same.<br /><br />And so I do not expect college to be much of a deciding factor... I would be very surprised to learn that leaving the bubble of Jewish education changes the statistics. For some, being in a situation where they stand out for standing for Judaism is actually an affirming experience.<br /><br />Our problem is that we're producing a weak community. Hiding in fortresses is the actions of the weak.<br /><br />We need a Jewish education after which these experiences don't influence, rather than relying on trying to eliminate the experiences. After all, they can not be isolated no matter what you do, AND you pay a price in those who leave something that feels stifling.<br /><br />You mention return rate. I wonder the same thing about kids at risk in general... How many become non-Orthodox, or even worse -- non-productive pot-head adults rather than returning?<br /><br />To some up my rambling (sorry): I think that (1) the solution is only to make people who can grow up and survive in the world as they will find it, not making cacoons; and (2) we do not have accurate statistics because we do not have anyone measuring only those who do not return and comparing them to those who leave a more insular environment permanently.<br /><br />-michamichahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13610506439687098313noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9926230.post-79847103352235008982006-12-25T21:39:00.000-05:002006-12-25T21:39:00.000-05:00That was really well articulated. Ditto with Steg...That was really well articulated. Ditto with Steg. While we are not Orthodox, the kids we know from the local college we have contact with are suddenly presented with options, options, options, and often not enough coping or decision making skills. For the truly committed Jews, testing the playing field is a temporary detour from the path. For those who were already on another path, college only accelerates this process for them. The kids whom we welcome into our home on shabbat and the chagim that end up keeping in touch with us on a regular basis are the ones that end up graduating into a serious Jewish life, whatever their 'in the moment' choices in college.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9926230.post-60769272766865460072006-12-25T21:19:00.000-05:002006-12-25T21:19:00.000-05:00I agree with your assessment of the situations; al...I agree with your assessment of the situations; almost all of my friends who left college less observant than they were in high school were already on their way towards that decision.<br /><br />And i can think of many more friends who <i>became</i> more religious/observant in college.Steg (dos iz nit der šteg)https://www.blogger.com/profile/07694556690190505030noreply@blogger.com